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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Guys, I was speaking to Gerald and he mentioned VPRacingFuels.com as a place to buy some big drums of high octane race fuel, for those of us in states like California where you can only get shitty 91 octane gas.

I wanted to ask if any of you in Cali have ordered before? Will they deliver here? I want to stick a 54 gallon drum right outside my side garage door so I can pump a few gallons of race fuel in with my regular gas, and get a higher octane so I can run better timing on my car.

Last question -- is gas octane a linear thing? If I mix one gallon of 91 octane with one gallon of 109 octane, do I now have 105 octane gas? Are there any pitfalls to doing it this way? If I orger 109 octane, and mix 2 gallons of that with 8 gallons of 91 octane, I should have 94.6 octane, right?

Manny
 

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THe only problem with race fuel is that it is typically leaded, not good for your 02's. Also, you cannot run cats if you use leaded gasoline. They do make 100-105 unleaded but it is about $3.5-4 per gallon. I buy toulene, it is about 116 octane and does not contain lead. I buy it from a local chemical company in 55 gallon drums. I think I paid about $2.6-2.8 per gallon.

I do think your math is correct on the projected octane.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Utah, I haven't gotten pricing yet, so I can't comment on that. However, it is unleaded and I have listed below what they have on their site for it.

As for Toulene, any drawbacks when using this? At 116 octane, I'd only need to put a gallon or so into my tank each time I fill up and I would be good to go to run full timing and max boost!

MOTORSPORT 109
Produces more power than any other unleaded fuel. Recommended for higher boost applications with CRs up to 11:1 or naturally aspirated engines up to 13:1.

• Color: Clear
• Motor Octane: 101
• R+M/2: 105
• Research Octane: 109
• Oxygenated: Yes
• Specific Gravity: .722 at 60° F
 

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Mosport 103 isn't leaded from VP racing fuels. That's the one I was telling Manny about. Manny call your local dist. and they'll be able to tell you.

91 Octane really sux over there in Ca. man. ... YOu don't want leaded. Bad for 02 sensors. Unleaded ONLY.

G
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Gerald said:
Mosport 103 isn't leaded from VP racing fuels. That's the one I was telling Manny about. Manny call your local dist. and they'll be able to tell you.

91 Octane really sux over there in Ca. man. ...
No phone number for my local dist. Clicking it just opens up an email address, and I have emailed twice. They also sell pure Methanol in gallon jugs /images/graemlins/smiles
 

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Where are you in CA? Your best bet might be to hit up a local dirtbike shop. I buy 55gal drums of VP C-16 straight from them with no shipping issues etc. You can get unleaded up to like 105, any higher and you will need leaded. As posted earlier, it will destroy the O2 sensors and cats if you still have them. Be careful when buying fuel, different weights and properties act vastly different. Going from C16 to 110 and the other high end stuff makes it a pain to tune, but can make more hp. The highly oxygenated fuels are very finicky when it comes to temp/altitude etc.
 

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Actually, check your local 76 stations. Although we here in Cali suffer from dishwater they call gasoline, 76 at at least 2 locations up here has 100 (and maybe 97 too, iirc) at the pump.

There's usually a line of supas/rx7s/etc, but its easy.

Another option of course is to fill up a container at your local race track - which usually has 76 in several octane ratings, including leaded race gas of course.
 

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We've ran MS109 on many occasions. It is the highest octane unleaded race fuel I've found. The important factors to look at when analyzing race fuels is the specific gravity and motor octane. MS109 has a motor octane of 101, MS103 has a motor octane of 99, and Sunoco GT104 also has a motor octane of 99. MS109 is priced around $320 for a 54 gallon drum.

Using MS109, you should be able to run fairly aggressive timing advance.
 

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It is difficult to obtain specifics on aviation fuel, but normally the drawback to aviation fuel is the low specific gravity.
 

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The only draw back to toulene is that sometimes it is hard to get because it is an ingredient for meth labs. I was lucky enough to find a guy who worked at a chemical company that also has a fast car and he uses it all the time. Good luck.
 

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What I would worry about is having 55 gallons of explosive material in my garage. Do you have to worry about that thing blowing up? Manny you mentioned you were putting it outside your garage. With the sun beating on that drum all day, it doesnt seem like the best idea...IMO.
 

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Smokin said:
What I would worry about is having 55 gallons of explosive material in my garage. Do you have to worry about that thing blowing up? Manny you mentioned you were putting it outside your garage. With the sun beating on that drum all day, it doesnt seem like the best idea...IMO.
I thought insurance companies were offering discounts for people with explosive material in or near there house ?? /images/graemlins/supergrin.gif

Actually Manny's property is big enough that if the drum did blow up he wouldn't even notice .
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Sal P. said:
We've ran MS109 on many occasions. It is the highest octane unleaded race fuel I've found. The important factors to look at when analyzing race fuels is the specific gravity and motor octane. MS109 has a motor octane of 101, MS103 has a motor octane of 99, and Sunoco GT104 also has a motor octane of 99. MS109 is priced around $320 for a 54 gallon drum.

Using MS109, you should be able to run fairly aggressive timing advance.
The MS109 from VP Racing Fuels out here is nearly $500 for the 54 gallon drum. I didn't know there was a price difference from state to state.

Also Sal, you mention that MS103 has a motor octane of 99 -- is the 91 octane from the pump actually 91 motor octane, or does it drop down as well?
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Yellow Fever said:
Smokin said:
What I would worry about is having 55 gallons of explosive material in my garage. Do you have to worry about that thing blowing up? Manny you mentioned you were putting it outside your garage. With the sun beating on that drum all day, it doesnt seem like the best idea...IMO.
I thought insurance companies were offering discounts for people with explosive material in or near there house ?? /images/graemlins/supergrin.gif

Actually Manny's property is big enough that if the drum did blow up he wouldn't even notice .
You crack me up Jeff!

Smokin, my garage stays pretty cool, so I suppose I could keep it in there. I would rather not though. The side of my house is shaded up until about 4 or 5pm, so not too worried -- I would cover them up with something anyway. I also have an equipment room about 50 feet from the house that I can store it in. Nice and cool. It does have a SPA heater in there with a burner though, but then again, the garage has the hot water heater with a pilot -- god forbid someday there were a ton of fumes for some reason (a mouse eating a whole in the container or something) -- sounds weird I know, but one of those fuckers ate through all my pool equipment cabling outside and also ate through a box and then a few 2 gallon buckets of whey protein in the garage. true.

Manny
 

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All pump gases are rated as Research+Motor/2 (the typical Yellow Sticker). 91 Octane at the pump is the average of research and motor. My guess for 91(R+M/2) is probably in the mid to high 80's on the motor octane.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Ok Sal, so now I am confused. My car (when timing is advanced) is tuned for 93 octane pump gas. All we have here is 91, so timing is pulled. If I want to get the octane to 93, and I have some MS103 which is 103 research octane bu 99 motor octane, then am I using the 103 rating to calculate it? So if I mix one gallon of 91 octane and one gallon of the ms103, I should have 97 octane, right?

If I used the motor rating of 99 octane for the ms103, then it wouldn't match the 91 research rating of the pump gas, correct?

Bottom line, if I mix a gallon of MS103 (99 motor octane and 103 research octane) with a gallon of 91 octane pump gas, what will be pump gas octane rating be? I'm guessing 97 octane, right?
 

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91 is the average octane rating as is 103 for MS103, hence the R+M/2 rating. For argument sake since specifics on pump gas motor octanes are not available, use 91+103/2 = 97 average octane.
 
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