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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I want to start by apologizing to the poor guy who ran the 10.06 and got his thread hijacked. A great effort indeed, sir.

But, to move the issues that PC started to a different agenda, a new thread.

I am going to mention just facts here, without the explicitives and I can only hope that PC can offer up the same.

1. PC stated some time ago that "anyone" could run a 1/4 mile race.

2. PC stated recently that I needed to "expand my driving skills"

3. PC also recently threatened me on a public forum

With the facts listed below, could PC please explain his statements from above?

1. PC's Viper makes 887 rwhp, thats 115 more than mine to the back tires and he has only managed a best of mid 10's and 135(?) mph on at least 3 different attempts at dragstrips. He blew up at my post on the "other thread" about torque and came down on us nitrous users, then started in on unorthodox methods of racing that are not readlily accessable and called me down on my driving skill. He also stated how a 7++ hp Viper went 143 mph, so I know he must be considering his own power numbers against his efforts.

Clearly by the looks of the difference in power, PC should be way out in front in a 1/4 mile race....unless of course (2) items exist, which are;
a. PCs inablility to drive his car to its potential
b. PCs car has longevity issues.

With regards to the threat made on the previous post, I don't know what the rules of this forum are, nor do I care, but personally I have a ZERO tolerance for threats made against me or my family. I can only hope that PC can make right on that issue.

In general, I have always liked Paolo, he has called me on a few occasions and seems to be very intelligent. He should respect more the efforts of those who do not share all of his likes and desires, as I try to do the same. It is difficult in business, especially the highly competitive and compact business of the Viper aftermarket. He should also understand that some of us want to share data, even though we are competitors and when he makes his condecending statements, some of us will act accordingly (as they do when I make mine, and believe me I do).

So, please answer as to why with 117 HP more, you are slower in a 1/4 mile race and why it would be advantagous for someone who would be clearly ahead of you at that point in both elapsed time and mph need to continue on for another 3/4 mile? and why should I expand my driving skills when I am almost a second quicker and 10 MPH faster in a 1/4 mile race with LESS POWER.

Keep in mind, that I am the first to admit that my Viper is basic and slow in todays standards of 1/4 mile racing. I expect to be outrun by a wide margin from someone with 100+ more power than me, thats why you don't see me on these forums picking on HMS and others (and I never pick on those who I know have less power).

I await your realistic response.

Tom
 

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I can see Paolo now, cutting and pasting so hard, open quotes, end quotes, typing away madly, picking the post apart, breaking a sweat to reply!... hahahahahah /images/graemlins/supergrin.gif


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Threats? Come on Tom... EVERYONE here can see that the (im paraphrasing here) "southern ass whopping" or iteration thereof, comment was not meant literally. We take physical threats of violence pretty seriously here, but at the same time, we can distinguish between ACTUAL threats and words spoken figuratively out of context.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Smoke,

While I "play hard" on the keyboard like most on this site (thanks by the way for allowing all the banter) I never go so far as to even hint at physical contact with anyone. Maybe I read too much into that kind of stuff (probably from my 4 years as a United States Marine where we didn't kidd around with threats). Unfortunately for me I guess, I don't associate a "Ghetto Ass Whoopin" with RACING. Maybe I need to brush up on my Ebonics??

Still waiting on a realistic reply.

Tom

P.S. I make PC this promise. If, and I got a feeling thats a BIG IF, he shows at the race next weekend, he will get outrun by me, thats a given, but I will be the bigger man and not devistate him on the forums even though he is making considerably more power than I am. Once the drag race is over, I will also offer him his roll-on race and I will street cruise with him as far as he cares to drive his car, and what ever else he wishes to contest against my Viper against his. His only victory could possibly come from HP on a dyno pull. Thats my prediction.

My only contingent is that once we have traveled up to around 150 mph on the roll on race and I am still ahead, I will lift off and consider the roll-on race won. It does not excite me to go 200 mph on the highways with other cars, animals, road debris and numerous other possible hazards, PC has never gone that fast in his Viper anyway and relatively speaking 200 mph is slow in my line of work.
 

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ViperJEDI took Paolo'a comments as a personal threat....

































BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
 

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weeztones said:
ViperJEDI took Paolo'a comments as a personal threat....

































BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
asshole














































:rofl:
 

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Tom, I will answer every single one of your questions as long as you do the same for me by the time I am done with my response to this one.........

First of all, I would like to thank you for starting a thread with my name on it!

You have really outdone yourself this time!

quote=ViperJEDI

I want to start by apologizing to the poor guy who ran the 10.06 and got his thread hijacked. A great effort indeed, sir.

But, to move the issues that PC started to a different agenda, a new thread.

I am going to mention just facts here, without the explicitives and I can only hope that PC can offer up the same.

PC-Tom, I am not sure what an explicitive is, I can only venture to guess you mean expletives.

Like in "The Matrix"...... Another system of control...... Right Tom?


quote=ViperJEDI

1. PC stated some time ago that "anyone" could run a 1/4 mile race.

PC-Hmmmmmmm, this is surely another question of interpretation.......

Let's see, has anybody here ever been to the dragstrip and seen some poor guy or girl running their AMC fishbowl shit-box car ala open differential{Of course doing a single wheel burnout to maximize their 60 foot time} going down the 1/4 mile? I know I have. ==> Is this what I meant? Probably not........

Could it be that anybody in America who has a driver's license and 25 bucks can go down the 1/4 mile? Maybe.

Does it make them a good driver to be able to RUN A 1/4 MILE RACE?

I guess not ANYBODY can run a 1/4 mile race, BUT depending upon the interpretation, my statement has quite a bit of validity.

I do not even know where you pulled up that statement, I do not doubt I said it.

Tom, do you even remember the context of that remark? Or are you just putting your own spin in your little effort to make me look like a bad-man==>Anti-dragstrip+Nitrous hating SOB?

You see Tom, I go to all types of street racing parking lots and hang out with Bad-ass motorcycle racers, Supra racers, Mustang and Porsche racers and more.

Most of these guys consider themselves to be very good drivers and 1/4 milers.

To put it mildly, I take quite a few of these guys/girls for rides.

Sometimes I give the other racers some of the information I have learned about say driving like how the weight transfers from the rear to the front as the brakes are applied...... Or what proportion of weight would be on each tire going through a turn or curve. I stress smoothness, watching the condition of the road surface very carefully, I go over the conncept of how to heel and toe downshift to make the engine speed match the speed of the car's speed in that gear, I can go on and on........

They are all impressed with how well the Viper can handle, brake, turn and HOLD the ROAD.

I am a positive representative for the Viper everywhere I go.

I am not the best roadcourse/dragstrip/Street racing driver on Viper Alley or .Org by a longshot.

One thing is for sure though what I know, I know.

I admit what I do not know and I try to learn what I want to know from the smartest, most qualified people I can get to lend me their ear......

Now this will bring us to the next recent statement you obviously need some clarification as to the intention.


quote=ViperJEDI

2. PC stated recently that I needed to "expand my driving skills"

PC- In light of how I try to live my life and learn how to do new things, I am sure it is asking too much of you to expand your repertiore of driving skills......

I have a question for you Tom: You have done 40+ 9-second passes or something like that in the last 18 months, right?

Pardon my ignorance, but

a. Please tell me when you did your 9.77 @ 146 MPH.

b. How Long did it take for you to get your suspension tuned to hook up like a motherF'er? The 1st time out with your 750 RWHP/950 RWTQ? The 2nd time?

c.If you have not gone appreciably quicker or faster lately don't you get bored going out and doing the same old shit over and over? I have spoken to some serious racers who have hit a plateau with their cars and do not keep going out to do what they already know they can do.

Tom, what makes you think you are exempt from "Expanding your driving skills"?

Are you really that fucking great? ==> You are one hell of a drag racer, way, way better than me without a question!

I would hazard to guess there are quite a few drag racers who are way better than you...... Does that reflect negatively on your abilities?

==> Absolutely not!

Tom, do you have the desire to be a better rounded driver?

I would hope so.

I know I would like to be as good of a drag racer as yourself someday. I think I just need to go to the dragstrip every weekend for the next ten years and I might have a shot.

To be honest, it is really not my thing==> I HAVE TRIED IT and will continue to do so.

5 years ago, I was the guy who would go into the Midas with the brake caliper pistons through the brake pad liners cutting into the rotors. I knew nothing about cars except how to go through the gears.(I was very capable of doing the 1/4 mile at that stage by the way.......)

Tonight I will be putting in the rebuilt transmission into my car assuming I have been able to properly center the friction disc with the POS centering tool that comes with the clutch.......

I have come to the whole Viper experience at a supreme disadvantage to guys like yourself who have done this shit for years......

I used to be a rollerskating pairs figure skater(where you lift the girl over your head) with my sister and was ranked as high as 4th in the world.

It is surprising how the mechanics of skating, automobile weight transfer, road course cornering, mechanical working of engines, clutches and transmissions are all really bound by the same physics.......

If you had not figured it out up to this point, this is how my brain works....

If you are offended that you could possibly be a better driver, I feel sorry for you==> But at least you might know I am just applying my standards to you.

I am sorry if I offended your nature.

quote=ViperJEDI

3. PC also recently threatened me on a public forum

PC- Tom this is a very interesting interpretation and obviously futile and infantile attempt to make me look like a violent MF.

We here is Chicago use the expression, "a ghetto asswhipping" to describe a spanking of epic proportions.

Got it? Good.

Please try to not be so dramatic.......

quote=ViperJEDI

With the facts listed below, could PC please explain his statements from above?

PC-
==>Tom I think you got your realistic response to those questions above and I will continue to answer the rest......

quote=ViperJEDI

1. PC's Viper makes 887 rwhp, thats 115 more than mine to the back tires and he has only managed a best of mid 10's and 135(?) mph on at least 3 different attempts at dragstrips. He blew up at my post on the "other thread" about torque and came down on us nitrous users, then started in on unorthodox methods of racing that are not readlily accessable and called me down on my driving skill. He also stated how a 7++ hp Viper went 143 mph, so I know he must be considering his own power numbers against his efforts.

PC- OK, Tom...... Where should I start?

Let's get the facts straight

1. I personally have have been to the dragstrip and have driven with slicks 2 times with the Heffner Supercharged Viper:

The 1st time on the same belt with which I did the entire Sport Compact Car Ultimate Street Car Challenge. The belt was slipping and the trans was not shifting properly. Upon removal of the belt It was obvoius many of the grooves had chunks missing and it was junk....

My mistake. I am no professional. But I am an incremental learner. 10.86 @134 MPH 1st time on slicks.

2nd time the trans, bent output shaft from differential housing exploding in MD, took a shit (when I was racing JR in the SVS powerglide Twin Turbo car) when it would not go into 3rd{we think beause of a combination of the Carbon clutch not releasing properly}==> I was racing and jammed it into 3rd anyway because I wanted to win. The trans blew up; GAME OVER.

The best run that day was a 10.5 @ 138.42 MPH with a 105 MPH 1/8 mile MPH. The run before was 111.xx MPH for the 1/8.

I also did a 10.6X missing 3rd to 4th.

I know you will say woulda, coulda, shoulda. But I remember some drag racing event you went to and you ran not as fast as you would have wanted on street tires because your clutch was pretty much smoked. Remember?

I did not look at that as an excuse as there was something mechanically wrong with the car preventing you from doing your best.

If you want to break my balls about making excuses, go right ahead.

By the way, what is your fastest 1/8 mile MPH ever?

On the first and only pass Jason Heffner made with my car in MD on slicks on the rears and pilot sports on the front, he ran 114.6 MPH in the 1/8 mile, he could not stay into it the whole way due to the car being all over the place with the radials/bias ply mix he still went 137 MPH.

The next pass resulted in my car being down for 3 weeks as the diff cover shattered breaking a whole bunch of shit and bending my steel driveshaft and the output shaft of the transmission.

It would have been very easy to say fuck the whole dragstrip thing due to the three times of the car being at the strip breaking a ton of shit.

But I am still trying like a fool.

Also, you belittle me about my drag racing skills, yet there are only a handful of guys with this kind of power who even drive their own cars.

Dr. Roof obviously has more dragstrip seat time than I do and he has gone faster and quicker than me. From what I remember, David never even drove a manual transmission car before the Viper, so he has done extremely well to say the least in typical David Boggs fashion.

Comparing myself to the rest of the 800+ RWHP Supercharger guys, I believe I am holding my own with the likes of Ben Treynor as we have similar power but are not yet quit up to snuff yet.==>Ben If you have recently run a 10.1 or 10.2, I apologize, but to my knowledge, we are both SLOW MOTHERFUCKERS compared to the likes of Heffner and Tom Welch and the SW's and Jamie Furmans of the world.
==> Maybe after we have the seat time these guys do, we might be more competitive.

This self proclaimed positive assessment of my developmental skills in terms of dragracing thus far are only my opinion. I admit I can and WILL be much better this time out in Texas.

Please level with me and everybody here on this board...Tom, have you set yourself a larger goal than your past achievements to date for Texas? Or will you be content to run a 9.7X for the next three years or so?

quote=ViperJEDI

"He blew up at my post on the "other thread" about torque and came down on us nitrous users,"

PC- Tom, you see you just do not seem to get it, you come on the boosted discussion and start touting the nitrous route.

Since you N2O comments were out of context in the Boosted discussion, I just mentioned a couple of N2O drawbacks like bottle filling and bottle pressure. You could also say turbos run too hot, you can say superchargers have belt limitations when you get to the ultimate horsepower levels.

quote=ViperJEDI

"Clearly by the looks of the difference in power, PC should be way out in front in a 1/4 mile race....unless of course (2) items exist, which are;
a. PCs inablility to drive his car to its potential
b. PCs car has longevity issues."

PC- Ok Tom, I think I have already covered a.

b. I would like to point out to all here that Tom is starting shit here to even bring up a longevity issue.

Tom, do you even know what is done to my motor? I would venture to guess the answer to that question would be a resounding NO!

In simple terms you are being the little instigator of gossip to make your nitrous cars appear to be "The way to go"==> "Don't waste your money when you can just put on the bottle......."

Like you said, this is a competitive business within a limited market segment... I am sure comments like this will sway guys who are on the fence and could possibly be interested only in the benefits of what the Nitrous can provide..... You are one hell of a salesman for your product. I guess the BTR sales are Machiavellian==. If that's how you want to do it or if that's the way you have to ge it done, I guess I am fine with that.

But if you are going to talk shit about my car and compare your stock engine with some juice and heads/cam and talk about longevity as compared to what is done to my engine I would have to laugh in your face. So would anybody who knows about engine building.

As far as I am concerned, your car is currently faster than the way my car is set up for the 1/4 mile.

Big fucking deal.

As far as I am concerned, there is much more to the Viper than the 1/4. I will sacrafice a few tenths for the ability to go 200+, take corners and sweepers like a motherF'er, threshold brake the car 200-100 MPH with ease and to be able to eat just about anything alive on the street except for some bikes and certain TT Vipers.

I know you put all your stock in the 1/4. I do not. I still try to excell even though it has cost me more money than I would have liked.

quote=ViperJEDI

"With regards to the threat made on the previous post, I don't know what the rules of this forum are, nor do I care, but personally I have a ZERO tolerance for threats made against me or my family. I can only hope that PC can make right on that issue."

PC- Tom, I have already covered this one above.

quote=ViperJEDI

In general, I have always liked Paolo, he has called me on a few occasions and seems to be very intelligent.

PC- Tom, whenever I have called you in the past we have had good conversations on the phone.

What I have always admired about you in the past was that no matter how many motherfuckers were breaking your balls, you always had an answer and always fought back.

quote=ViperJEDI

"He should respect more the efforts of those who do not share all of his likes and desires, as I try to do the same."


PC- Tom, do you really, what about the time when you got up my ass about the Sport Compact Car shootout saying the "Grandma test" was not a way any manufacturer uses to asess the HP/TQ/performance of their car.

Tom, I have nothing against Nitrous, it's just not anything I would put anywhere near my motor, that's all.

From what I recall YOU are guilty of coming into numerous supercharger dyno sheet discussions and breaking everybody's supercharged balls about "Just take it to the track!" "How come a supercharger car can't run a nine?" And all this B.S.

Tom, You just said, "He should respect more the efforts of those who do not share all of his likes and desires, as I TRY TO DO THE SAME."

==> Who is full of shit now?

Just face it, you are just as guilty as the next asshole like myself or Gerald{Don't worry big guy, I mean that in the best possible way as I named myself first} or anybody else as we are debating/trying to break balls to get our points across.

quote=ViperJEDI

It is difficult in business, especially the highly competitive and compact business of the Viper aftermarket.

PC- Tom, I believe I have covered this one too already.

quote=ViperJEDI

"He should also understand that some of us want to share data, even though we are competitors"

PC- Tom, what the hell do you think we were doing before you showed up there posting your dyno sheet?

We were discussing the fact that Sal's Heffner Twin Turbo is one bad motherfucker and how it is faster than my supercharged car.

We were also discussing the hypothetical outcome of my highway roll on with John Hennessey.

There was no discussion of Nitorus cars, no mention of Tom Welch and his Nitrous cars, I do not even remember the people in the discussion wondering to themselves, "hmmmmm, What would TOM WELCH do in this situation......"

You drew first blood with the comment about how you like your high torque/lower RPM power as it has greater reliability/etc......

In case you did not notice, we don't give a shit what you like because it did not really have anything to do with the discussion. :bonk:


quote=ViperJEDI

"and when he makes his condecending statements, some of us will act accordingly (as they do when I make mine, and believe me I do)."

PC- Tom, you even say you deserved my comments.

My whole point was that SINCE WE ARE ON THE SUBJECT OF TORQUE, {With the world according to TOMMIE WELCH WHERE TORQUE IS KING}==>Isn't it INTERESTING Sal's Turbo Viper went almost as quick and as high of a MPH as YOUR NITROUS VIPER WITH 100 more LBS/FT?

quote=ViperJEDI

"So, please answer as to why with 117 HP more, you are slower in a 1/4 mile race and why it would be advantagous for someone who would be clearly ahead of you at that point in both elapsed time and mph need to continue on for another 3/4 mile? and why should I expand my driving skills when I am almost a second quicker and 10 MPH faster in a 1/4 mile race with LESS POWER."

PC- You know Tom, for a tuner who claims to know how to get cars to go fast, You seem to be forgetting your primary lesson: TORQUE. Not to mention you are a better 1/4 miler.

Cut the 117 RWHP advantage B.S. and quit trying to weasel out of the truth that we already know.

I never claimed to be able to beat you in the 1/4.

This is where you should listen to your own advice==> "He should respect more the efforts of those who do not share all of his likes and desires, AS I TRY TO DO THE SAME"

Tom, do you?

quote=ViperJEDI

Keep in mind, that I am the first to admit that my Viper is basic and slow in todays standards of 1/4 mile racing. I expect to be outrun by a wide margin from someone with 100+ more power than me, thats why you don't see me on these forums picking on HMS and others (and I never pick on those who I know have less power).

I await your realistic response.

==> Yo Tommie, this is PC from Chicago, I have answered all yo questns and axed you some Q's myseylff... Don't foget to answer ayll my questns eitha! Y'all be cool and keep it real(istic), the response that is!

Signed, yours truly, P.C., Ghetto ass whoopin Viper all around racer extraordinaire!
 

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3300 words. Shit! Most of my essay's aren't that long!
 

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Paolo,

Its Friday nite! What're you doin' typing the next Great American Novel for?? Get down to Texas as the Sole Tornado and deliver them there Texans a Texas size whoopin!

Later all,

Jay K.
 

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hehehe, You've outdone yourself Paolo... /images/graemlins/supergrin.gif
 

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Moundir said:
fuck who's got cliff notes :help:
Paolo fired the logical equivalent of "War and Piece" across the bow of some people selling the Viper version of Amway.


(And Paolo used the 16 inchers /images/graemlins/supergrin.gif)
 

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Damnit Paolo.. you need to learn to summarize what you want to say ;) You keep posting like that and I'm going to need a translator.
 

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Yeah, not shit. That was the first Viper post I have ever read that took me over a minute to get through. Holy crap! Good stuff though.

And you asked Tom to answer all of your questions, so if he quotes you prior to his replies, it should be the longest post ever on this forum! Wooo hoooo!
 

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Paolo,

I had to print that in order to take it all in. I can only hope that a power surge did not happen while you were typing the last sentence! LOL

I only found one question that you "axed me" and it was involving the term "explicitives". You have my definition wrong. My definition of explicitives is cuss words and slang. My post leaves out the bullshit (example of an explicitive). Nothing is written about me trying to control anything, any conversation or anyone. Thats not my game.

As for drag racing, and all other motorsports, I enjoy it all. I have NEVER STATED THAT I AM A BETTER DRIVER THAN ANYONE....please find that in a thread and post it for my apology. I created a video from hundreds of phone calls from Viper owners who wanted to know how I race my own Viper. The story behind that is;

When the HMS 650R came out and received many headlines and coverstories (and it was a bad ass car in its day) the first one was tested on the 1/4 mile by its owner, Phil Simms of ORlando Fl. I was at the track that night. Phil ran 10.80's with that car, we were there running 10.60's with stock everything and a nitrous kit. Folks caught word of it and started to call. I got tired of typing and talking so I made the tape.

I have been asked to drive fellow Viper owners cars and have done so with good results, but I have never driven someones car for hire, I am not a professional.

I do take my racing seriously, I am a poor loser (like most real winners) and will not sit still while folks bash what I do or what I sell.

With regards to the post that started this whole gig, the talk about the mans pass was long finished and the thread had moved into torque vs. hp conversations. That is why I posted the dyno sheet. I bet you $ 100.00 you cannot find on any of the Viper forums where I have posted a dyno sheet more than (3) times in the history of the forum. So get off the soap box of post hi-jacking! And get your WEAK ass off of the nitrous guy vs. the supercharger guy bullshit! You supercharger and turbocharger people have been bashing each other since day one, worse than cannibals! You never see the nitrous guys bashing each other like that. Grow UP!

As for the 9.77 and the 146 mph. Those were two different passes. The 9.77 in Bradenton earlier this year and the 146 mph was at our Zone mini VOI last month. I wonder how many other Vipers have made 40+ 9 second passes on the same engine?

As for being bored with running the same times over and over, I never get bored. I own a 7 second drag car that runs 180 MPH in the quarter and I race my Diesel truck that runs 15's at 90 mph and they are all a pleasure to race! I only need 2 tenths of a second to equal the baddest stroker, multi direct port nitrous, 6 speed vipers, but I gladly trade those 2 tenths of a second for my current daily drivability.
The difference between you and I is that you are an anylist on paper but have no practical application to back up your data...ie you don't race where the rest of us do, so your data means nothing to us. Your drag racing data lends no credibility to your accomplishments...keep practicing. So, when and if you ever run that quick, you too will want to do it over and over again.



As for "expanding my driving ability" your original text spelled this out in a condecending manner which warranted the response that it is you who has more power and goes much slower who needs to expand their ability. I offer to match driving skill with you on any platform at any time. We can even go a step further and try motorcycles or airplanes if you really want to show us your stuff, big boy! So as you would say "raise up and git yo travel on, or sit back and chil in your weak ass crib with a flat spliff, no shit!!"



As for being content with my 9.7's. For what my Viper has for mods, there is not a quicker Viper on the planet. I am competition motivated. When someone with a "top end" package and a throttle body nitrous or any other single power adder on a v-10 with stock drivetrain goes quicker, I might be enticed to do more. My immediate goals are for my customers. We have several new items coming out and my goal is to see customers go quicker than my own car.



I think that I have responeded to most of your requests without trying to ramble or fall into the same old beat up conversations.



I will be in Texas and ready to race. I will extend you the courtesy of not hammering the shit out of you for a race as I know deep down that you cannot win....regardless of the reasons. I will be the bigger man. I will be available to race you at the track and on the street if conditions permit and do whatever other kinds of driving challenges that you can put together. Above all, I am a competitor, so have your shit RIGHT or shut the Fuck UP, my neega!(some explicitives so your Chicago ass can understand clearly what I mean!..no offense to the rest of the Chicagoland Viper owners)

Tom
 

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Tom - I am gonna show you WHO IS THE BIGGER MAN and give you the hillbilly whipping of your life........... at the bar the nite before, so lets see how well you race the next day.
 
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