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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've seen the question asked enough times, and just went through the process myself, that I thought I would post this. Said question being, what bolts to use, are they reusable etc.

The factory flywheel bolts are supposed to be a one time use as they stretch upon final torque during bolt-up. According to Jon at Parts Rack, the factory bolts can be reused ONCE. According to him Arrow does that.

The bolts that I used are ARP's from Dan at Viper Specialty. They can be reused over and over and are WAY cheaper than the Mopar replacements. They take a 16mm 12pt socket.

The pic below is the used factory bolt as compared to the ARP. According to Dan the slightly shorter length of the ARP does not matter because in either case they both go all the way through the flange on the crankshaft that the flywheel bolts to.

A helpful hint... Clean the screws, even new ones as they will be oily, with a non-residue type of cleaner before applying red Loctite threadlocker. Loctite is simply a color coded engineered strength superglue and it DOES NOT stick to oil.



When I ordered my ARP flywheel bolts from Viper Specialty I also had him send me new bolts for the clutch cover; the pressure plate. See the pic below, the factory screws from my car are the longer ones and the shorter ones are the Mopar replacements he sent. Set beer down, scratch head...



So I called Dan and he said that the Gen 2 bolts are no longer available and that those short ones are SRT. Definitely too short, as well as they are one time use. A quick side note before I explain why the SRT bolts are one time use, Dan said that most of the time his clutch kits come with bolts and the factory bolts go in the trash. I used an eBay Luk kit and they do not come with bolts. So Dan wasn't paying attention is the moral of that story LOL. Anybody need some brand new SRT bolts? :D

Back to the SRT bolts being one time use and the Gen 2's being multiple use. As you can see in the pic the SRT bolts have no solid shoulder but the Gen 2's do. Take a look at my flywheel below and you can see a counterbore to receive that shoulder. Hence the Gen 2's drive the torque on the solid part of the bolt but the SRT's drive on the weaker threads.

As with the flywheel bolts clean and use red Loctite.

 

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I just reuse the old bolts. Use a little blue loctite too. Never had an issue.
 

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I just reuse the old bolts. Use a little blue loctite too. Never had an issue.
Me too....but you see, dave is making about 1500 HP and 1600 TQ less than "we" are so what do we know !!

:D
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Haha you guys can always do what you want and I won't argue with it. But I do trust engineers and their recommendations, and am not so cheap that if said engineers are correct, to risk losing part of my leg if the rotating parts disconnect from each other.

Oh, and my Mobil 1 decals on my front splitter are worth 10 rwhp per side so fuck off. :D
 

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Haha you guys can always do what you want and I won't argue with it. But I do trust engineers and their recommendations, and am not so cheap that if said engineers are correct, to risk losing part of my leg if the rotating parts disconnect from each other.

Oh, and my Mobil 1 decals on my front splitter are worth 10 rwhp per side so fuck off. :D


I believe the engineers too. They say Mobil 1 can go 25,000 miles before being changed. I haven't changed my oil in 10 years.........................





:D :D
 

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I've also used the clutch and flywheel bolts multiple times with no negative effects.
I would consider those ARP bolts if I was going for >1000hp. I wonder if you could find an ARP bolt that would work for the clutch as well?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I've also used the clutch and flywheel bolts multiple times with no negative effects.
I would consider those ARP bolts if I was going for >1000hp. I wonder if you could find an ARP bolt that would work for the clutch as well?
Call Dan at VSP. The flywheel bolts were only like $5 each -> $40 total cheeeeeeeeeeeap insurance mucho warm fuzzy.
 

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Haha you guys can always do what you want and I won't argue with it. But I do trust engineers and their recommendations, and am not so cheap that if said engineers are correct, to risk losing part of my leg if the rotating parts disconnect from each other.

Oh, and my Mobil 1 decals on my front splitter are worth 10 rwhp per side so fuck off. :D
So you won't argue about the metal heat shields that the "engineers" had placed at the spark plug boots ?? :D
 
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
So you won't argue about the metal heat shields that the "engineers" had placed at the spark plug boots ?? :D
Well fuck yes I will. I'll argue that the ceramic boots are just as effective and look way better LOL!

Metal... Ceramic... Get your boots!!!
 

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Haha you guys can always do what you want and I won't argue with it. But I do trust engineers and their recommendations, and am not so cheap that if said engineers are correct, to risk losing part of my leg if the rotating parts disconnect from each other.

Oh, and my Mobil 1 decals on my front splitter are worth 10 rwhp per side so fuck off. :D
Don`t forget your hood vents.They have to be worth a couple more.;)
 

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I spoke with Frank at Viper Engineergeek Inc of America Ltd, and he scoffs the 10hp from each Mobil 1 sticker. He said 4 hp at the most from each sticker based on size and location.
 

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The pic below is the used factory bolt as compared to the ARP. According to Dan the slightly shorter length of the ARP does not matter because in either case they both go all the way through the flange on the crankshaft that the flywheel bolts to.

Almost... actually the OEM protrudes just a hair, however the both bolts penetrate the flange more than enough for their thread size. The ARP still engages about .700, where the OEM engages .850, with .050 hanging out the other side. With a 7/16-20, anything over .500" would be considered "extra" when threaded into steel. Regardless, if someone has an extra thick flywheel or something along those lines, I can get different lengths on request, but I generally only stock the 1.000x7/16" for the Tilton Lightweights, and the 1.250x7/16' for the Tilton Heavyweights & OEM flywheels. [As well as the 1/2-20 variants for the Gen-4 Modified clutches/flanges taken up from that dinky M10 they run]




When I ordered my ARP flywheel bolts from Viper Specialty I also had him send me new bolts for the clutch cover; the pressure plate. See the pic below, the factory screws from my car are the longer ones and the shorter ones are the Mopar replacements he sent. Set beer down, scratch head...

So I called Dan and he said that the Gen 2 bolts are no longer available and that those short ones are SRT. Definitely too short, as well as they are one time use. A quick side note before I explain why the SRT bolts are one time use, Dan said that most of the time his clutch kits come with bolts and the factory bolts go in the trash. I used an eBay Luk kit and they do not come with bolts. So Dan wasn't paying attention is the moral of that story LOL. Anybody need some brand new SRT bolts? :D

Back to the SRT bolts being one time use and the Gen 2's being multiple use. As you can see in the pic the SRT bolts have no solid shoulder but the Gen 2's do. Take a look at my flywheel below and you can see a counterbore to receive that shoulder. Hence the Gen 2's drive the torque on the solid part of the bolt but the SRT's drive on the weaker threads.

Yep, my bad on this one. Most of the clutches I install are multi-disc, and come with bolts. The Gen-2 bolts are a "not serviced" item per Mopar, and the Gen-3 bolts are what I had listed on my computer by mistake. The Gen-2's do drive on the shoulder, so short of breaking them off when torquing them down, they are fine to re-use. Even the Gen-3's could be re-used in most cases.

To date, I have not seen a clutch bolt break in service that was torqued correctly, that did not break while being torqued during the installation.
 

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Almost... actually the OEM protrudes just a hair, however the both bolts penetrate the flange more than enough for their thread size. The ARP still engages about .700, where the OEM engages .850, with .050 hanging out the other side. With a 7/16-20, anything over .500" would be considered "extra" when threaded into steel. Regardless, if someone has an extra thick flywheel or something along those lines, I can get different lengths on request, but I generally only stock the 1.000x7/16" for the Tilton Lightweights, and the 1.250x7/16' for the Tilton Heavyweights & OEM flywheels. [As well as the 1/2-20 variants for the Gen-4 Modified clutches/flanges taken up from that dinky M10 they run]






Yep, my bad on this one. Most of the clutches I install are multi-disc, and come with bolts. The Gen-2 bolts are a "not serviced" item per Mopar, and the Gen-3 bolts are what I had listed on my computer by mistake. The Gen-2's do drive on the shoulder, so short of breaking them off when torquing them down, they are fine to re-use. Even the Gen-3's could be re-used in most cases.

To date, I have not seen a clutch bolt break in service that was torqued correctly, that did not break while being torqued during the installation.
Dan:

which multi-disk clutch is the most popular.
 

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I've seen the question asked enough times, and just went through the process myself, that I thought I would post this. Said question being, what bolts to use, are they reusable etc.

The pic below is the used factory bolt as compared to the ARP. According to Dan the slightly shorter length of the ARP does not matter because in either case they both go all the way through the flange on the crankshaft that the flywheel bolts to.

A helpful hint... Clean the screws, even new ones as they will be oily, with a non-residue type of cleaner before applying red Loctite threadlocker. Loctite is simply a color coded engineered strength superglue and it DOES NOT stick to oil.




As with the flywheel bolts clean and use red Loctite.

Why do you recommend the use of 271 (red, super-high strength) instead of 242 (blue, standard strength) thread lock compound? Your first picture clearly shows the factory flywheel bolt with BLUE compound on it. I would put your recommendation down to simple personal preference, rather than one based on observed failure due to insufficient bond strength.

IMO, the primary reason to have any threadlocker at all is to seal the crankshaft bolt holes against engine oil seepage past the threads. A clean, unstretched, properly torqued high strength bolt should be able to be reused several times as long as the installation requirement is not "torque to yield". Most torque specifications are such that the fasteners are loaded safely within their elastic stress range.
 

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Jack B- The McLeod is the most popular overall because of its price point, but when someone drives a Tilton Carbon car that is set up right, that is usually their first choice if it is in their price range. I suspect the Spec Carbon would be a nice compromise between the two, but I have not driven one.

Dean- Having taken apart plenty of OEM and aftermarket setups, the threadlocker used on the OEM bolts may be blue, but it prevails just as hard or harder than a Red threadlocking compound put on after. Blue comes off very easily by comparison.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Why do you recommend the use of 271 (red, super-high strength) instead of 242 (blue, standard strength) thread lock compound? Your first picture clearly shows the factory flywheel bolt with BLUE compound on it. I would put your recommendation down to simple personal preference, rather than one based on observed failure due to insufficient bond strength.
Dean, the red Loctite is simple the color chosen by Loctite for their high strength locker. Not necessarily an industry standard color coding system, hence the factory blue may be the same strength or beyond what Loctite red is.

Also, I try to always qualify my statement with Loctite red, as opposed to just red threadlocker.

Finally, I used it because I trust Dan who recommended that it be used.
 

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I'd say the chances are probably 4:1 that Chryco uses Loctite(R) 242 (blue) on those bolts. They have such industry dominance that most people - including me - just say "blue" or "242".
 

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Jack B- The McLeod is the most popular overall because of its price point, but when someone drives a Tilton Carbon car that is set up right, that is usually their first choice if it is in their price range. I suspect the Spec Carbon would be a nice compromise between the two, but I have not driven one.

Dean- Having taken apart plenty of OEM and aftermarket setups, the threadlocker used on the OEM bolts may be blue, but it prevails just as hard or harder than a Red threadlocking compound put on after. Blue comes off very easily by comparison.
I can atest to the fact tht the oem thread lock is similar to red in its holding strength. i have taken a few apart that were next to impossible to break. To go one step further, the hardest one to break was a leaker.

What is the part-only cost on the McLeod.
 

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I can atest to the fact tht the oem thread lock is similar to red in its holding strength. i have taken a few apart that were next to impossible to break. To go one step further, the hardest one to break was a leaker.

What is the part-only cost on the McLeod.

Shoot me over an e-mail or a PM, and let me know whether you want it with Steel or Aluminum flywheel.
 
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