What I think might be easiest would be to just separate VPA anc VCA into two completely indepedent financial entities. To keep VPA unique to Vipers and not just another Mopar parts distributor make it so that you have to be a VPA member to be able to buy things from them. That way VPA could still sponsor VCA at events and stuff and would really be no different than any other vendor. If VPA wants to donate money to VCA for something they are more than welcome to, but it would come across as a check written from one to the other. I think people are trying to put the wrong blame on VPA at times. They're a part distributor that can get some really good pricing and has the tooling and other things necessary to keep these cars alive. Sure they might try to push people away from other vendors, but that's just business. If there is a competitor you try to do what you can (within legal limits of course), to try to win your customers' business. The question becomes the integration with the club, not the fact that VPA is there to begin with.
What I think might be easiest would be to just separate VPA anc VCA into two completely indepedent financial entities. To keep VPA unique to Vipers and not just another Mopar parts distributor make it so that you have to be a VPA member to be able to buy things from them. That way VPA could still sponsor VCA at events and stuff and would really be no different than any other vendor. If VPA wants to donate money to VCA for something they are more than welcome to, but it would come across as a check written from one to the other. I think people are trying to put the wrong blame on VPA at times. They're a part distributor that can get some really good pricing and has the tooling and other things necessary to keep these cars alive. Sure they might try to push people away from other vendors, but that's just business. If there is a competitor you try to do what you can (within legal limits of course), to try to win your customers' business. The question becomes the integration with the club, not the fact that VPA is there to begin with.
A little birdy told me that VPA sold 1 mill of Viper parts sourced from Mopar last year. If that is correct, and I was a Chrysler dealer, I would be pissed as they are undercutting me with my large facility and staff overhead. If VPA didn't send any money from those sales to VCA why is this allowed? No benefit to the dealers, Chrysler or VCA, just to..oh..the Marshall family. That's not going to last long. They can sell at cost plus Marshall family wages all year long and not worry about profit and return on capital
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Last edited by sundiego; August 27th, 2013 at 11:42 AM.
A little birdy told me that VPA sold 1 mill of Viper parts sourced from Mopar last year. If that is correct, and I was a Chrysler dealer, I would be pissed as they are undercutting me with my large facility and staff overhead. If VPA didn't send any money from those sales to VCA why is this allowed? No benefit to the dealers, Chrysler or VCA, just to..oh..the Marshall family. That's not going to last long. They can sell at cost plus Marshall family wages all year long and not worry about profit and return on capital
I think this gets at the core of the Chrysler letter.
What I think might be easiest would be to just separate VPA anc VCA into two completely indepedent financial entities. To keep VPA unique to Vipers and not just another Mopar parts distributor make it so that you have to be a VPA member to be able to buy things from them. That way VPA could still sponsor VCA at events and stuff and would really be no different than any other vendor. If VPA wants to donate money to VCA for something they are more than welcome to, but it would come across as a check written from one to the other. I think people are trying to put the wrong blame on VPA at times. They're a part distributor that can get some really good pricing and has the tooling and other things necessary to keep these cars alive. Sure they might try to push people away from other vendors, but that's just business. If there is a competitor you try to do what you can (within legal limits of course), to try to win your customers' business. The question becomes the integration with the club, not the fact that VPA is there to begin with.
The VPA the way that it was intended is not a bad idea which is why Chrysler allowed it. The problem is that it was created by people that could no longer control the club in a leadership position (past national National Officers) and allowed them to control the club from behind the scenes while still being employed by the club since the VPA is owned by the VCA. 100% of the profits from the VPA are suppose to go to the club. I do not know of a single check written to the VCA from the VPA and I doubt anyone else could provide one either. When asked about these "profits" you get an answer of "The VPA donated XYZ to ABC's regional club function". The VPA books have never been shared with even the board of directors to my knowledge and it's been asked to multiple times. The VPA IS the problem due to the people running it.
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2010 ACR-X #26
Last edited by MTGTS; August 27th, 2013 at 11:58 AM.
In a normal environment, if the manufacturer was going to sell the parts and tooling for a car that was going out of production, those parts and that tooling would have been put up to bid.
There are a plenty of well heeled Viper owners (and other businessmen in general) who would have been interested in buying all the spare parts and tooling for the Viper. It appears that process never took place, and instead out of altruism, Chrysler essentially gave those parts - at cost - to the VCA so the money would benefit the club.
It appears that instead of doing that, club management set up a few members with cushy jobs and unfair advantages. It is not enough to simply split them apart - the original wrong needs to be righted. I really have no idea how to do that, but it needs to happen.
Someone mentioned earlier that it might not be a problem if VPA paid $1k for an event and VCA paid $1k, but someone incurred travel expenses.
I disagree. Even if the travel expenses were $1k and were paid for by the VPA... it still is against what VPA is supposed to be about - benefit for the membership, not cushy jobs for a few insiders. In this example, even if the travel expenses were $1k, it's not OK if VPA paid for it, because that is $1k that was *supposed* to go to the club from VPA, but was instead spent on unwarranted expenses.
When asked about these "profits" you get an answer of "The VPA donated XYZ to ABC's regional club function".
Which Parts Rack used to do, generously. And Jon B knows one hell of a lot more about Vipers and what is right for them than the entire BOD and VPA put together.
Technically the VCA/VPA thing is the other way around (non-profit VCA owns for-profit VPA to my knowledge), but I still understand the issue. In the end you have a for-profit company feeding money into a non-profit company, which effectively makes the non-profit for-profit if the money gets exchanged freely.
You have two buckets of money, one VCA, the other VPA. If an event gets held, which bucket is being drawing from? People might think that their membership dues are being wasted and spent on frivolous things, but in reality the money might be coming from the profits of VPA. I'll agree the main issue is that there needs to be documentation of these two "buckets". Realistically, since they are both owned by the same company, it's all just one bucket in the long run, but it would be nice to see where the money came in from to know if the amount going out is reasonable and coming from the right sources. For a really simply example if membership dues brought in $1000 and VPA brought in $1000 from sales but someone bigwig gets flown to an event that costs $1500, members might have a right to be angry. However, if VPA brought in $2000 then the membership dues haven't necessarily been touched because VPA is using its own profits to fund whatever they choose.
I'm not sure if you meant it this way, but the way I read it, I would still have a problem with the above scenario. The money the VPA makes is supposed to go the club, not "whatever they choose".
I know I'm raising the numbers here, but following the above logic, if the VPA made $100k for the club, the top officers could choose to take $100k in free trips/benefits? Um, no.
Raffle is not being held here , so imagine it will be done however they originally planned. We are just assigned the car by SRT as rules require Corporate to go through a Dealer since they are not a direct to the consumer distributor.
Didn't Mark J offer to video tape and put the drawing on fb earlier in this thread? (post #177)
Looks like Woodhouse is distancing themselves away from the raffle
Last edited by MTGTS; August 27th, 2013 at 12:22 PM.
I think this gets at the core of the Chrysler letter.
Bingo. I've been told by a VCA Director that this is exactly one of the problems. Marshall has even been known to ship parts to Chrysler dealers for install by the Viper Tech. This really pisses the dealers off.
Interesting turn of events with the raffle. Bill P just posted this on the VCA forum:
Didn't Mark J offer to video tape and put the drawing on fb earlier in this thread? (post #177)
Where is the drawing being held then? Let me guess Lee's house with Mary pulling the magical ticket. Glad I didn't buy one this year this is becoming like McDonald's monopoly game that a few years ago was rigged by a 3rd party company.
Where is the drawing being held then? Let me guess Lee's house with Mary pulling the magical ticket. Glad I didn't buy one this year this is becoming like McDonald's monopoly game that a few years ago was rigged by a 3rd party company.
Probably, but it was printed on the flyers that it was taking place at Woodhouse
The funniest result would be they award the car, the raffle declared illegal, the person keeps the car and they have to give refunds to everyone else. Or the car has to be returned, used, and the winner can sue.
Bingo. I've been told by a VCA Director that this is exactly one of the problems. Marshall has even been known to ship parts to Chrysler dealers for install by the Viper Tech. This really pisses the dealers off.
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