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Has anyone ever run a wastegate with their supercharger setup?

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Has anyone ever run a wastegate with their supercharger setup?
Old January 2nd, 2012, 10:31 AM   #1
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Has anyone ever run a wastegate with their supercharger setup?

Been giving this some thought.

My Paxton car currently only makes about 10-11 psi with the 2.75" blower pulley. With a larger crank pulley, the blower could make considerably more boost/power. However, the car is currently making 951 rwhp on pump gas and is virtually impossible to hook on the street until over 70 mph.

I'd like to run more boost, but I certainly don't need it all the time.

My proposed solution would be to increase the size of the crank pulley to bump the boost up around 15-16 psi, but install a wastegate with maybe a 9 or 10 lb spring, so that I could set it to never exceed 10 psi for street driving. I could adjust it with an electronic boost controller like a turbo if I needed more. In theory, this would allow me to run as much or little boost as I want with my supercharger, using the wastegate to control everything.

Has anyone ever run a wastegate setup with their supercharger? Any issues? any potential problems?

Sounds cool to me in theory, having adjustable on-the-fly boost control over a blower. But not sure if it's possible.
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Old January 2nd, 2012, 03:21 PM   #2
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The ZR1 uses a bypass valve to accomplish this. That's why some ECU tunes seem to add more than you'd expect, as they actually can eek out another pound and a half or so. Other than the parasitic losses associated with compressing more air than you actually need, I don't see why it wouldn't work.

Why not go with one of the traction control systems out there? They'd pull out timing or drop cylinders as needed to maintain traction. That way you don't pay a price on the top end. In addition, if you can hook up, the weight shift to the back will allow the computer to dial in more power. You can also set the amount of slip. That way you can keep some of the fun of being able to light them up/slide the tail, but it won't be uncontrollable, rev-limiter action.
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Old January 2nd, 2012, 03:23 PM   #3
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Boost Almighty ran a big Pro Charger BOV on his Paxton set-up.
And I know of one local guy that ran a BOV with his Paxton too.
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Old January 2nd, 2012, 06:05 PM   #4
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I had a tunner friend of mine do this to a customers car and it worked out well. I also saw a write up of a company that used a boost controller wired to a switch to select different boost levels.

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Old January 2nd, 2012, 06:24 PM   #5
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Alot of the big power drag cars are running waste gates to control there boost with a AMS1000. some are even running two gates. You will just have to figure out how much pressure it requires to hold gate shut to make x amount of boost. It may not always be a 1to1 figure.
For example 6lb spring with 5lbs on the gate may not always = 11lbs boost. Just keep that in mind as you play with it if you decide to go that route.
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Old January 2nd, 2012, 07:45 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Hollywood View Post
Boost Almighty ran a big Pro Charger BOV on his Paxton set-up.
And I know of one local guy that ran a BOV with his Paxton too.
I've got a good BOV on the car, but that just prohibits the air from going back upstream when the throttle slams shut. It doesn't control boost per se.

The wastegate is what would control the boost. Once you get enough psi to open the wastegate, everything else bleeds off, leaving boost set at a particular pressure.

Generally, people don't run wastegates on blowers. They use pulleys to set the boost. My 2.75" blower pulley makes 11 psi at redline. Always. I can't force it to make more, and I can't make it make less.

With a wastegate, I could pulley the blower to make 16 psi, but set the wastegate spring so it would bleed off air (boost) over say 9 psi and it would hold 9 psi to redline. Or I could use a boost controller to turn it up or down.

Just looking to see if anyone around here has done a wastegate setup on a blower with a Viper.

All input is appreciated.
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Old January 2nd, 2012, 08:45 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyBravo View Post
I've got a good BOV on the car, but that just prohibits the air from going back upstream when the throttle slams shut. It doesn't control boost per se.

The wastegate is what would control the boost. Once you get enough psi to open the wastegate, everything else bleeds off, leaving boost set at a particular pressure.

Generally, people don't run wastegates on blowers. They use pulleys to set the boost. My 2.75" blower pulley makes 11 psi at redline. Always. I can't force it to make more, and I can't make it make less.

With a wastegate, I could pulley the blower to make 16 psi, but set the wastegate spring so it would bleed off air (boost) over say 9 psi and it would hold 9 psi to redline. Or I could use a boost controller to turn it up or down.

Just looking to see if anyone around here has done a wastegate setup on a blower with a Viper.

All input is appreciated.
the BOV does control boost. how much tension you put on the diaphram spring, too little will bleed boost, and vice versa.
i run the hi boost pulleys on 3 of my paxton cars and they all have the big 'mondo' (i think thats the name) BOV and i have to adjust the pressure on the bov until it matches what the blower is putting out.
if you ran a waste gate set to say 15lbs and you where still running your BOV to its oringinal setting, then the BOV would bleed off above its set point and you wouldnt make the boost you were after.
so you would need to adjust both the bov and the waste gate to the same psi
but once you do it would be a great idea and should work great just setup everything like the turbo cars are
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Old January 5th, 2012, 01:06 PM   #8
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been doing it with great results for over 6 years!
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Old February 4th, 2012, 10:45 AM   #9
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A wastegate bypasses exhaust gas around the turbine. You dont have a turbine.

You're talking about a bypass valve that bypasses the supercharger to limit boost.

You would use a standalone boost controller like a profec b and it can be used to control a bypass valve.

Your potential problem is going beyond your compressor efficiency with the novi 2000.
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Old February 4th, 2012, 08:06 PM   #10
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sorry but there are alot of supercharged cars with wastegates on the compressor pipe to control boost.

Maximum boost is determined by the pulley. Gate will vent to create a leak and controller will close the leak to increase boost to the blowers maximum

Last edited by [email protected]; February 4th, 2012 at 08:11 PM.
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Old February 4th, 2012, 10:13 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boomer View Post
the BOV does control boost. how much tension you put on the diaphram spring, too little will bleed boost, and vice versa.
i run the hi boost pulleys on 3 of my paxton cars and they all have the big 'mondo' (i think thats the name) BOV and i have to adjust the pressure on the bov until it matches what the blower is putting out.
if you ran a waste gate set to say 15lbs and you where still running your BOV to its oringinal setting, then the BOV would bleed off above its set point and you wovuldnt make the boost you were after.
so you would need to adjust both the bov and the waste gate to the me psi
but once you do it would be a great idea and should work great just setup everything like the turbo cars are
.....no, a bov is a blow off valve. It is designed and intended to blow off, or open when the throttle body closes to prevent impelled surge in the blower if turbine. Ie, prevent it from rapid changes in acceleration . It us very very poor at accurate boost management. A wastegate on the other hand is designed to control boost pressure accurately....especiallly when attached to a boost controller.
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Old February 4th, 2012, 10:16 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DChan415 View Post
A wastegate bypasses exhaust gas around the turbine. You dont have a turbine.

You're talking about a bypass valve that bypasses the supercharger to limit boost.

You would use a standalone boost controller like a profec b and it can be used to control a bypass valve.

Your potential problem is going beyond your compressor efficiency with the novi 2000.
A wg can be used with a supercharger just fine. In conjunction with a bov.
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Old February 4th, 2012, 10:19 PM   #13
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The nlr controllers are the best I have ever used. Super super dead nuts accurate . I always use co2 with mine . Can not be beat. I'll use an ams1000 with my twins for sure
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Old February 6th, 2012, 09:09 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drlee50 View Post
.....no, a bov is a blow off valve. It is designed and intended to blow off, or open when the throttle body closes to prevent impelled surge in the blower if turbine. Ie, prevent it from rapid changes in acceleration . It us very very poor at accurate boost management. A wastegate on the other hand is designed to control boost pressure accurately....especiallly when attached to a boost controller.
You misunderstood what I said. I wasn't saying use a bov like a wg. But to make sure your bov is set to handle peak boost.

If the bov isn't set up to handle the peak amount of boost you intend on building then it will bleed off to its set level.
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Old February 6th, 2012, 09:14 PM   #15
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I recently read an article about this somewhere. Lemme go see if I can find it.
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Old February 6th, 2012, 10:45 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boomer View Post
You misunderstood what I said. I wasn't saying use a bov like a wg. But to make sure your bov is set to handle peak boost.

If the bov isn't set up to handle the peak amount of boost you intend on building then it will bleed off to its set level.
bov should have a vac line on top. that will apply the boost pressure to it...thus keeping it closed at any boost level, given that has enough spring pressure at zero vac to keep it closed. most bov's actually flutter open at idle, under vac. there isnt much "setting up of a bov" to handle a set amount of boost. what are you refering to when you say it will " bleed off to its set level"?
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Old February 6th, 2012, 10:57 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boomer View Post
You misunderstood what I said. I wasn't saying use a bov like a wg. But to make sure your bov is set to handle peak boost.

If the bov isn't set up to handle the peak amount of boost you intend on building then it will bleed off to its set level.
the tricky thing with a BOV is when you are in a drag racing situation and you are on the throttle, in big boost and you have to get out of, and then back on it, sometimes the bov will open, and if you are back in boost quickly, the boost pressure will hold the bov open due to the surface are of the valve and the intake boost pressure pushing on it vs the smaller pressure of the vac lines boost pressure pressing on the back of the valve. the bov ends up hanging open and you accidentally bleed off boost. it might bleed off to some pretty repeatable boost level, but nothing accurate or repeatable. sometimes you have to shim the bov spring tighter to prevent this.

I am not sure if you are using a vac line on yours or just springs to "set it up".
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Old February 9th, 2012, 04:26 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drlee50 View Post
the tricky thing with a BOV is when you are in a drag racing situation and you are on the throttle, in big boost and you have to get out of, and then back on it, sometimes the bov will open, and if you are back in boost quickly, the boost pressure will hold the bov open due to the surface are of the valve and the intake boost pressure pushing on it vs the smaller pressure of the vac lines boost pressure pressing on the back of the valve. the bov ends up hanging open and you accidentally bleed off boost. it might bleed off to some pretty repeatable boost level, but nothing accurate or repeatable. sometimes you have to shim the bov spring tighter to prevent this.

I am not sure if you are using a vac line on yours or just springs to "set it up".
im talking about the boost pressure overwhelming the spring preload.
the BOV needs to be adjusted with enough spring pressure to keep it from leaking boost.
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