We decided to side step the whole street car vs race car debate by using a race car for racing. its lighter and safer too. nothing against gary, chad, etc. who have crazy fast street cars.
I agree. Just because Chad's car has air conditioning, heat, stereo system, power windows, remote keyless entry, headlights with low and high beams, tail lights, turn signals, windshield wipers with intermittent wiper delay, stock seats that recline and slide forward and backward reupholstered by Venzano, driver and passenger air bags, tilt leather wrapped steering wheel, rear defroster, remote rear hatch release, factory oil pressure gauge, factory water temperature gauge, factory fuel level gauge, factory speedometer, factory tachometer, factory voltmeter, reverse lights, power side mirrors, fully adjustable shocks on all four corners, stainless steel brake lines, cigarette lighter, ashtray, air filters, mufflers, instrument cluster dimmer switch and runs mid 8's on 93 octane fuel on RADIAL TIRES doesn't make it a street car. Oh wait, yes it does.
At no point is there a straight line between the rear differential and the driven rear hubs. At no point has the rear suspension travel been "locked out". The car has adjustable shock and changing the suspension characteristics is as simple as turning a knob. How does an independent rear suspension"act " like a solid axle? Did it have to take acting lessons? Do I know everything about drag racing that I will ever know? No. But I also don't watch a video of someone else's car and then proceed to tell them how there car is put together either.
I could probably use a straight axle? Don't speculate. Don't tell me what I could probably do. Merely making that statement makes you look less intelligent.
PS. I noticed that your signature says that you are "the originator of the first". Can someone be the originator of the second? It;s kind of redundant. It's like saying "hey look at that round circle". You should change that. Just an observation.
Not this time, was a good trip last year though for sure.
Yea...I heard.
You seem to really be getting into this drag racing thing. You should buy one of these Viper things and get busy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper4Christ
Are you making it out again this year?
Its possible but not 100% at this point. I was going to buy Chad's GTS and drive it into the 7.80's but since I have learned it has a solid rear axle with no rear suspension...I'm out!
I agree. Just because Chad's car has air conditioning, heat, stereo system, power windows, remote keyless entry, headlights with low and high beams, tail lights, turn signals, windshield wipers with intermittent wiper delay, stock seats that recline and slide forward and backward reupholstered by Venzano, driver and passenger air bags, tilt leather wrapped steering wheel, rear defroster, remote rear hatch release, factory oil pressure gauge, factory water temperature gauge, factory fuel level gauge, factory speedometer, factory tachometer, factory voltmeter, reverse lights, power side mirrors, fully adjustable shocks on all four corners, stainless steel brake lines, cigarette lighter, ashtray, air filters, mufflers, instrument cluster dimmer switch and runs mid 8's on 93 octane fuel on RADIAL TIRES doesn't make it a street car. Oh wait, yes it does.
Jr. I think this color suits you better.
Jason, it is touching you went to all this trouble to make such a complete list of the amenities on Chad's ride. I would think you might have something better to do with your time.
At no point is there a straight line between the rear differential and the driven rear hubs. At no point has the rear suspension travel been "locked out".
Tell me this: if he car does not squat at all on a high stall converter launch leaving the line under a ton of power off the trans-brake, when does it ever squat?
If it does not squat, there IS a straight line between the rear differential and the driven rear hubs PERIOD.
The car has adjustable shock and changing the suspension characteristics is as simple as turning a knob. How does an independent rear suspension"act " like a solid axle? Did it have to take acting lessons?
All I can tell you about acting is you're acting like a little girl.
Do I know everything about drag racing that I will ever know? No. But I also don't watch a video of someone else's car and then proceed to tell them how there car is put together either.
Hey, the video does not lie. There are also other people who are thinking the same thing and seeing the same thing I got out of the video.
I could probably use a straight axle? Don't speculate. Don't tell me what I could probably do.
Let me qualify what I said earlier:
My point was since you locked out the rear suspension you could "probably" use a straight axle and not have a problem. get it?
There was no speculation, it was my observation to make a point. There are probably a few other things I could tell you to do but it is not appropriate in this thread.
Merely making that statement makes you look less intelligent.
Is that so?
Says who?
You? ==> You sidestepping the truth about the locked out-ness of Chad's rear suspension makes you look like a you are hiding something.
I can understand wanting to keep your secrets to yourself, but it is obvious for all to see the distance from the top of the tire to the bottom of the rear fender DID NOT MOVE ONE BIT.
==> So drop the charade and pull out of this one before you dig yourself deeper and lose credibility.
You ran a 7.996 with, for all intents and purposes, a straight axle, not an IRS.
PS. I noticed that your signature says that you are "the originator of the first". Can someone be the originator of the second? It;s kind of redundant. It's like saying "hey look at that round circle". You should change that. Just an observation.
I notice you have a lot of time to nitpick my signature and how I spelled automatic. Why don't you man up and just say what you have to say without the sarcasm and condescension? It would suit your persona much better than what you have put forth thus far in this thread.
You seem to really be getting into this drag racing thing. You should buy one of these Viper things and get busy.
Yeah I herd those things are really nice, although I also herd the newer 03 and up ones look like big S2000's... nahh couldn't be
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toby
Its possible but not 100% at this point. I was going to buy Chad's GTS and drive it into the 7.80's but since I have learned it has a solid rear axle with no rear suspension...I'm out!
They should have hired you last year instead of Tony then, 7.80's would stand for quite sometime. Solid axel......? What solid axel?
Paolo, If Jason used shocks and springs to make the IRS "work" more like a solid rear, and a solid rear works better.........
Then isn't that what one is supposed to do ? I mean the goal for anyone drag racing is to go as quick as they can, from stock to wild that is why we drag race.
Your statement is wrong: You ran a 7.996 with, for all intents and purposes, a straight axle, not an IRS.
I'm not sure why you think that is correct or why you even care. It's an IRS even if it mimics a cow.
If someone were to put "solid" shocks on a Viper.....it's still an IRS. The housing does not float in a Viper...a solid rear floats. You take what you have and you make it work the best it can. Are you going to start calling B.S. because the fast Supras squat five times more than a stock Supra ???
Honestly, I'm lost here and can't figure it out. Even in a race car vs street car
debate this IRS discussion has no place.
__________________
1996 GTS CPE TWIN TURBO !!
Old Roe s/c numbers:
9.28 @ 151mph with nitrous
9.68 @ 144mph no nitrous
10.41 @ 149mph on Pilots
Greg Good cylinder heads and cam !!
2004 black SRT10 (SOLD)
Not to flame anyone but the IRS no matter what you do to it can NOT be near as affective as the solid rear. The main thing you will be missing is that the IRS unit does NOT move "housing". Which is the key ingredient for why the Solid rear hooks so much better. You need the turning from the housing it self that pushes on the control arms "traction bars" That hook to the frame or uni-body to put lift towards the front of the car as you launch which in return cause weight transfer to put more weight on the rear tires.
and I also no that it would not be a good idea to remove the working suspension out of an IRS car.
I can vouch for this as me and Paul were talking about the vette last year on the trip. And long story short, switching to a full on solid rear in that car + some tuning took him from low 9's into the high to mid 8's and eventually to an 8.49. Also to note, the car dropped a fair amount of weight when switching over as well.
If anyone feels like doing a side by side comparison:
in a game of semantics - I think that sums it up best
fact is most any car running 8's let alone 7's is not going to be driven home without a change of tires at least... and likely a few more adjustments than that
it's all good. who cares?
A race car can be a street car and vice verser - long as they are fully legal to drive - the only cut off is in our minds.
My cut off for a street hot rod is when cars run such high valvespring pressures and on the edge motors they can't even drive inter-state. THAT is no street car because they're worthless for anything more than a pose down to the club and maybe a quick squirt before you go home to reset the tappets. MAny Pro Street cars fall into this "street" delusion... wow... why don't we just add lights to a ProMod add plates and DOT tires - then drive to Hooters. If we add enough meth it might not over heat.
No Viper in this discussion falls close to that delusion. All can be driven anywhere the owner wants to go - what more matters?
Last edited by Torquemonster : September 21st, 2006 at 01:29 AM.
Very high class bitching session we have going on here. The whole street car vs. race car debate is about as pointless as the supercharger vs. turbocharger debate.
To criticize someone's vehicle because that person chose to build it to suit their own needs is complete BULLSHIT! Chad and Heffner have earned the right to categorize Chad's car however they damn well please without justification to ANYONE!
If anyone has the sack to show them up, BRING IT TO BRADENTON! Banging on the keyboard and spewing nonsense won't cut it.
__________________ '99 Viper GTS
Full Weight - IRS - Drag Radial
Built by Drummond Race Cars
Turbo System by Heffner Performance / Turbo People
Best ET: 7.52 Best MPH: 190.19mph on DR's
Last edited by Viper TT : September 21st, 2006 at 09:42 AM.
