Thanks. I appreciate it. And although it is true that I do own a GTS, it is a 97 not a 98 and I am Chuck 98 RT/10 not Chuck 98 GTS. That's the other Chuck.
I've heard in the neighborhood of $10k per year; you'd think a contract like that would have been discussed or made available to the membership.
that is outrageous. they give him complete control over the site. he can delete anything he wants. and he gets paid?
if i were a vca member i would be outraged.
payments to this clown must be hidden in their "financial report" to VCA members. Hey GTSDean - have they posted their "financials" anytime since the last time you had to hound them to do so?
Thanks for making us aware of this since I rarely go to the VCA website. Chris is truly an asset to the VCA and gives a tremendous amount of his time to putting on events and helping other members. If they threw him under the bus I would immediately cancel my membership.
While we are on the topic of VCA and more specifically the VCA website, I feel I am among a growing group that sees Jay Hebert as the biggest liability to the VCA. I don't know if you read some of his posts on a thread concerning your participation in the One Lap, but they were offensively biased and innaccurate at best and libelous at worst. When I cautioned him about his continuing persecution of you being not only unprofessional, but also putting VCA in what I felt (in my opinion as an attorney) was a legally precarious position, he immediately deleted the entire thread.
Guys, lets not only make sure that people like Chris stay in leadership positions where they belong, but that also people in the VCA who are using their positions in the organization to push their private agendas get ousted for it.
That thread that was deleted contained part of an ongoing argument that I have had with Jay regarding his deleting and editing of posts. I was posting the OLA results primarily because one of our local members (Jon Swango) was in it. Jay immediately presumed it was because I was trying to promote Hennessey (we can spell it correct here right?).
Anyway I also called Jay out when he made that post about John having two customer cars that had a fire. I explained that I was at Indy and saw the white roadster fire (John will probably remember that it was a stuck fuel injector). But according to forum rules Jay should not be allowed to post it unless he had first hand knowledge. He does not abide by the same rules he dictates.
BTW I get that same response in person with the 2 more senior members of the Michigan region. Unwilling to discuss HMS or the VCA web site. Both topics are for private back room discussions only.
John I posted a copy of the financials that were shown back then. It was in 2003. Last financials I can recall.
MAYBE SOME CURRENT MEMBERS CAN CALL THEM OUT FOR THE 2005 RECORDS INCLUDING PAYMENTS TO JAY HERBERT. I WOULD ASSUME THAT THEY WOULD SEND HIM A 1099 TOO.
The thread was deleted. Those assholes need to be exposed for the frauds they are. John, I think your account of what is going on is extremely close to reality. It will be a great day when Dodge pulls the plug on them.
First, sorry I am so late to reply on this one. Second, sorry for putting it back at the top!
I wanted to thank John and everybody else for the very kind note and thoughts. I scored my 25 in-zone sigs (33) and a helluva a lot from elsewhere (44), including a couple after the deadline. Very flattering to say the least and greatly appreciated! Of course the alarm was a tad bit unfounded - nobody slipped in their candidacy at the last minute. Still, nice to have covered that possibility just in case.
As to the comments made in that now-moved thread, it was very interesting to say the least, and certainly accurate in others. As I said in my final post on that thread (the Cliff Notes version): "Got the signatures, the VCA needs work, the Zone officer positions are unrewarding and unused, and there is indeed a clique that few can ever hope to infiltrate."
The VCA serves two purposes: A car club for people that own Vipers and, like it or not (and I kinda like it), a marketing tool for DaimlerChrysler. It is sometimes poorly served by a small "secret society" that makes decisions largely without member - or even board member - input. Like any successful car club and/or marketing campaign, you listen to what your customers want. You are rewarded with growth and often prosperity. Ignore those customers and you end up feeding resentment and sometimes even fuel a competing product. Like Viper Alley.
Thanks again for the many kind notes and phone calls. It is on to another day, as soon as I can find my way out of Texas...
Last edited by Kansas : May 17th, 2006 at 07:35 PM.
GLAD TO HEAR IT WORKED OUT FOR YOU. HONEST GUYS LIKE YOU WHO'S REAL AGENDA IS TO HELP VIPER OWNERS HAVE FUN IS HOW THE VCA WAS FOUNDED.
AND I WILL BE THE FIRST ONE TO SAY THAT FOR ALL THE SUPPORT DODGE HAS GIVEN THE VCA OVER THE YRS THEY SHOULD CERTAINLY BE ABLE TO REAP SOME VALUE BY USING THE CLUB AS A MARKETING TOOL.
I JUST WISH THE DODGE MARKETING PEOPLE WOULD TAKE NOTICE ON HOW THE VCA IS BEING MISMANAGED - WHICH WORKS AGAINST THE BRAND. ALL IT WOULD TAKE IS ONE DODGE EXEC TO TAKE NOTICE OF HOW THE VCA HAS BECOME RIFE WITH A GROUP OF LEADERS (MOST BUT NOT ALL) WHO ARE A BUNCH OF SELF SERVERING TWITS. THEY HOLD THE POWER AND THE PURSE STRINGS THAT COULD BE THE CHANGE AGENT TO SAVE THE VCA FROM ITS DOWNWARD COURSE.
CHRIS - I WISH YOU WELL IN YOUR FUTURE EFFORTS WITHIN THE VCA. YOU ARE ONE OF THE FEW GUYS THERE WHO HAS SHOWN THE LEADERSHIP AND SERVE OTHERS FIRST ATTITUDE THAT IS WHAT HELPS ANY ORGANIZATION SUCCEED.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Y2K5SRT
First, sorry I am so late to reply on this one. Second, sorry for putting it back at the top!
I wanted to thank John and everybody else for the very kind note and thoughts. I scored my 25 in-zone sigs (33) and a helluva a lot from elsewhere (44), including a couple after the deadline. Very flattering to say the least and greatly appreciated! Of course the alarm was a tad bit unfounded - nobody slipped in their candidacy at the last minute. Still, nice to have covered that possibility just in case.
As to the comments made in that now-moved thread, it was very interesting to say the least, and certainly accurate in others. As I said in my final post on that thread (the Cliff Notes version): "Got the signatures, the VCA needs work, the Zone officer positions are unrewarding and unused, and there is indeed a clique that few can ever hope to infiltrate."
The VCA serves two purposes: A car club for people that own Vipers and, like it or not (and I kinda like it), a marketing tool for DaimlerChrysler. It is sometimes poorly served by a small "secret society" that makes decisions largely without member - or even board member - input. Like any successful car club and/or marketing campaign, you listen to what your customers want. You are rewarded with growth and often prosperity. Ignore those customers and you end up feeding resentment and sometimes even fuel a competing product. Like Viper Alley.
Thanks again for the many kind notes and phone calls. It is on to another day, as soon as I can find my way out of Texas...
Not trying to start a shit storm for myself, but, there are a number of "facts" being presented here which are just not true. Amazing how fast mis-information travels. I'm posting here because there are so many VCA members that post and read this site. As a defense to the accusations made here, I'm typing this note. I know there are many of you who despise the VCA...and that's fine. Many of you have valid reasons to, but, many don't. Everyone is entitled to their opinion.
First, I'll confirm the ONLY fact that was posted here. Chris is an asset to the VCA, and a personal friend of mine. My opinion- The VCA National administration has never been in more capable hands than it is today. Steve F, Joe H bad guys? Absolutely not, quite the opposite. They continue to offer valuable assistance where they can.
Not to beat a very dead horse, but, are we really giving out business ethics advice?
Is that all in the past...perhaps...but it will take years of clean slate to clear up the muddy waters and past dealings.
Anyone having issues with the VCA website, send me a PM and I'll make sure your issues are addressed. Jay does NOT MAKE $10K per year off the website...period. Now, exactly how much, I'm looking into. I believe that there should be no paid VCA positions whether formal or informal. I can't give you the full story now, but, I'm digging into it.
It seems that this conspiracy theory has proved unfounded and that much of the mis-information here is unfounded or based on bad facts and half truths.
Congrats to Chris! I look forward to moving the VCA foward with your input and assistance. And I will continue to read this site as a great source of entertainment, information and opinions.
It seems that this conspiracy theory has proved unfounded and that much of the mis-information here is unfounded or based on bad facts and half truths.
If you yourself don't know the answers, how can you call them half-truths, bad facts or say they are unfounded?
Knowing a little bit about how it probably went down when Jay sold the site to the VCA, there is definately something going to Jay. Jay himself has made representations as such, so I have no reason to believe otherwise. If you say I am wrong, prove it.
In the 2003 financial report it showed this line item under expenses: 6) WEBSITE $24,315.55. Okay, knowing that the site hadn't upgraded ANYTHING at that time, where in the hell did $24K go? No way that the hosting or maintenance was even half of that. Why don't you ask Jay what he REALLY made or get an accounting of how that money was spent.
Ten bucks says he won't answer. If you are going to put out a line item like that, then given the exact nature of the numbers, you should know exactly where every penny went.
And yet - we've been told for YEARS that the website was completely separate and self funding - paying for itself by the revenue generated from advertising.....
There's just way too much that goes on under the covers. Some driven by Dodge, some by JR Thompson, and some by the VCA.
I don't believe that any of the VCA folks are "bad" people. The current group of folks has been trying VERY hard to get the club back in the black - even when faced with previously undisclosed debts.
The hybrid nature of the club - are we funded by Dodge, are we independent - makes for an overall complicated mess.
__________________
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, martini in the other, body totally worn out and screaming ~ WOO HOO what a ride!
Anyone having issues with the VCA website, send me a PM and I'll make sure your issues are addressed. Jay does NOT MAKE $10K per year off the website...period. Now, exactly how much, I'm looking into. I believe that there should be no paid VCA positions whether formal or informal. I can't give you the full story now, but, I'm digging into it.
Given adequate opportunity to defend or contest that statement Jay was silent. Strange as he hooked onto other aspects in the same thread.
If you are looking for improvements I have one. Stop the asterisk BS. Applying asterisks for words that Jay chooses as inappropriate (note there is no list available just trial and error). The one that gets me most is "Hennessey." I am not defending JH at all, but not allowing posts that allow free discussion and understanding is political BS. How can new owners determine what the publc knows if it is all asterisked out? (On a side note I do find it odd that Hennessey is rated very highly on this boards tuner rating - you would think someone would have recorded the bad experiences given how much we have heard through the years).
Also I have had Jay delete posts as I wrote them (he was obviously seeking them out) because I was stating something he personally disagreed with. He is NOT the VCA spokesman and judge.
And yet - we've been told for YEARS that the website was completely separate and self funding - paying for itself by the revenue generated from advertising.....
And here-in lies my issue - Chris may or may not have been a target of an old-boy network trying to replace him; but we know that these kinds of activities still exist today and it wouldn't be beneath some. I brought up the subject of Jay's compensation as an example of this network and how it continues to operate to this day.
We know now that the website has asked for the money back that it gave the VCA; the justification being that the website earned it and somehow it was earmarked to go back into the site. If you were to take out Jay's compensation, I would bet that payback wouldn't be necessary. One might question why Jay was being compensated to begin with when everyone else who spends a significant amount of time volunteering are not.
The website is an eginma to the VCA - it owns it, but exercises no control over it. The VCA doesn't even know the relationship between its own organization and the guy who runs the website. Even now officers play that line "if you don't like it, contact your local rep", but we know thats bullshit and meaningless.
The truth of the matter is, the website is not accountible to the VCA and the VCA has no control over its own website.
So you'll excuse me if I share a laugh with some others when someone suggests anything I said is inaccurate when they themselves admit they don't even know the truth. HOW CAN YOU NOT KNOW YOU HAVE SOMEONE BEING PAID BY YOUR ORGANIZATION?
It's just silly and pointless - like much of the website it all comes down to one guy who is not accountible to anyone. Don't even get me started on the whole Web Committee joke.
