good point Chad - however in the case of the Viper I believe that the less time to mph and the extra power wasted in drivetrain losses with an auto is more than compensated for by wastiong less power down to the pavement...
if an auto can average an extra 200hp along the 1/4 over a T-56 (which wastes power not just to shift but also to wheelspin and boost undulations)- then mph will go up along with the better ET...
i have had both stick and auto turbo cars and no doubt auto with the proper combo is faster and quicker.
Your civic doesn't count
The fact of the matter is that no one has run these ~1500 h.p. cars at the same boost level with both a stick and an auto. Mike HKS and Torquemonster did the best job of articluating the argument so far and they may be right. However, I think when the day is done, people will still see higher trap speeds out of the 6-speed at a comparable power level. Apparently Chad is going to do a real world test shortly.
Ron, you haven't made any argument as to why you take a side, you simply say "I'm on the side of (insert name of your hero)." I don't put a whole lot of stock in that.
Kenny it's obvious the swamp water is affecting your brain however this is UGR and Roofs post and i do not want to detract from there accomplishment. I will not reply any more regarding your comments until you take the training wheels off your tricycle and fly solo. Paul is on here with his vette, just ask him how fast the six speed would be? I assure you it would not be 8.40's but you are the expert so why don't you let us know remember we are talking 1/4 mile.
Kenny it's obvious the swamp water is affecting your brain however this is UGR and Roofs post and i do not want to detract from there accomplishment. I will not reply any more regarding your comments until you take the training wheels off your tricycle and fly solo. Paul is on here with his vette, just ask him how fast the six speed would be? I assure you it would not be 8.40's but you are the expert so why don't you let us know remember we are talking 1/4 mile.
Paul changed out the 6-speed because the corvette's rear mounted tranny configuration will not stand up to high horsepower launched on slicks---not because the auto was faster. Again, the auto will e.t. beter but will mph slower than the 6-speed. This has been universally true on the cars I have built and run. I'm really tired of arguing with an ignorant newb who is latching unto the nuts of whoever he can---first Paolo, now Paul (hmmm...is there a pattern here).
kenny one more try from me to explain it in more details :
with the 6speed you take off, when you have to shift into second or third and have to let go of the gas, the rear will come up, when you engage again that power surge could throw the car side ways with all that power , so its imposible to compare the same power levels in auto versus 6sp ...
with the auto say a 3 speed or power glide, car takes off all the power is to the back, weight transfer will not change the hole way down, rear will stay planted during the whole run , both hands in the steering wheel holding the progresive boost controler on the fly, up or down as the car reaches more speed and feals loose or tighter , and increase boost as you pick up speeed, you also have better control of the AEM function of traction control, with the auto tranny .
if you are running 600hp cars and under, yes a 6speed is better and will get you better MPH ,but when you reach the power these cars are making auto is the way to go
I'm really tired of arguing with an ignorant newb who is latching unto the nuts of whoever he can---first Paolo, now Paul (hmmm...is there a pattern here).
I think I know the answer to this one, can I guess?
KENNY, KENNY are you "reaalllyyy" that dense? Mike-HKS has tried to explain something to you but a bag licker like you just cannot comprehend. Some people swing off nuts but buddy you lick nuts and whatever they are close to ie; the little wrinkle hole. There seems to be only one pattern for you dumb and dum--- you fill in the blanks.
Good grief. I'm on page 4 of this thread and I had to go back to the top of the thing to remember what it was supposed to be about. Talk about a threadjack.
I visited briefly with Kevin offline and wanted to publicly say "congratulations" to him and David Boggs. I don't think there is any question that Underground has stepped up to the plate and built a car that performs. That does NOT take anything away from Heffner/Chad or Gerald and the guys at RSI or even Paolo for what they've done or are trying to do.
Being new to the Viper community, I'm just glad to see that there are so many reputable choices out there for those of us who are horsepower junkies. In the Supra world, we were at the mercy of one or two tuners for YEARS. It took a long time before parts came down in price and cars went faster for less money. Competition is a good thing.
Here's my prediction for Bradenton, and I'm about 100% sure I'll be right:
No matter who wins, we all win. You know that each of the top tuners will bring their A game to the event, which means it's a win-win deal for us consumers. What's my downside to Bradenton? The suckiest tuner in the country builds a 8.99 car? Honestly. Think about it. What's going to separate the fastest car from the second fastest car? A tenth of a second or a couple miles an hour? All I see happening is that everybody puts on a hell of a show, everybody proves they can build an EXTREMELY fast car, and everybody has a good time. Beyond that, it's all taste and personal preferences.
Congratulations to Underground and David Boggs for the new numbers this week. If they fall in December, big deal. Every time the bar gets set higher, the Viper community wins as a whole.
That's just my lowly 610 rwhp opinion.
You will now be returned to your regularly scheduled programming.
Congratulations. That's hell of a fast car.
What are those sparks, what is scraping there?
When are you planning to break this record with a GEN 3 Viper?
Bradenton will be very interesting to see with all the new toys...
Congratulations. That's hell of a fast car.
What are those sparks, what is scraping there?
When are you planning to break this record with a GEN 3 Viper?
Bradenton will be very interesting to see with all the new toys...
Thanks... :thumb: I will not have my SRT at this next Viper race. It will be done soon though. It goes into fabercation next week. The motor, AEM and fuel system is completed :thumb: I will post some pictures as soon as im done in a month or so
Paolo, sorry but I disagree. I'm new to the viper game, but I have raced a bit and I can tell you that with otherwise identically modified or stock vehicles, the manual always traps higher. I understand that the auto spends more time on the gas, I just don't think it's enough to make an auto trap higher than a manual. Chad himself has said that there was a major hp difference between his 8.75 and the auto run.
That said I think at the state of tune from his auto run, that same car would have trapped as high or higher with a stick---maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think so.
As to anyone who got their panties in a bunch over the nitrous comment, I wasn't the first to mention it---others have suggested it as an explanation of the mph increase between the eighth and the traps. Also, I made the comment tongue in cheek because I truly believe Roof's car has already been faster and will be faster at Bradenton. I wasn't trying to rain on Kevin's accomplishment, because getting a pig like a Viper down the strip in that time is a major accomplishment, even if it used more power adders than the Liberace mobile.
Are you saying that those 6 second turbo doorslammers running around are going to trap higher with a manual?
High horsepower turbo cars and manuals are an oxymoron. I should know, I own one. An auto will keep pace with a manual on the big end with a lock-up converter. Once you hit lock-up it feels like you hit another gear.
I can see you are not familiar with Ronnviper's credentials: he is far from being a newbie and has been an informed member on the Viper boards for years:
I am going to take a minute to swing from ronnviper's balls and tell you that he has and has had several low to mid nine second Buick Grand Nationals with autos and stick shifts. He has built quite a few bad-ass motors and drives his cars on the street and kicks ass! He is a drag racer through and through and has enough experience in a lot of areas. I trust his experience and expertise and routinely solicit his opinions when it comes to turbos, turbocharing and drag racing questions.
I am going to take a minute to swing from ronnviper's balls
Paolo
Tis,tis whats your fire dog going to think aren't you worried that she will get jealous. Does this mean that we wont be seeing the 2 of you together, French kissing and all, so sad. I guess on the positive side your 2 legged girl friend might be happy if she moves a notch closer ahead of the 4 legged one.
Have a great day my friend even though you are just a little strange. I think the reason I like you is that I finally found someone a bit stranger than I am. I just don't do those things that you do with the dog, now that is off the scales strange.
THIS BEASTIALITY THING IS GETTING OUT OF CONTROL...............FIRST WARDO WITH THE KOALA BEAR IN AUSTRALIA AND NOW PAOLO WITH HIS DOG(MANS BEST FIREND?)
THIS BEASTIALITY THING IS GETTING OUT OF CONTROL...............FIRST WARDO WITH THE KOALA BEAR IN AUSTRALIA AND NOW PAOLO WITH HIS DOG(MANS BEST FIREND?)
"TX WHOS YOUR FATHER" WHAT ARE YOU DOING UP SO EARLY? Are you still hiding the silver from the wagon train of relatives? You might want to start checking ID at the door. Wasn't going to tell you until after the super feast but the bus load were not related, I picked up that crew from under the bridge. Told them that they would have to claim relative status and they would get a mean and the yearly check if they promised not to show at Christmas , damn double dippers. Don't you hate the ones that get in line twice? Did you buy the optic sensor to scan for proper ID?
"TX WHOS YOUR FATHER" WHAT ARE YOU DOING UP SO EARLY? Are you still hiding the silver from the wagon train of relatives? You might want to start checking ID at the door. Wasn't going to tell you until after the super feast but the bus load were not related, I picked up that crew from under the bridge. Told them that they would have to claim relative status and they would get a mean and the yearly check if they promised not to show at Christmas , damn double dippers. Don't you hate the ones that get in line twice? Did you buy the optic sensor to scan for proper ID?
THIS BEASTIALITY THING IS GETTING OUT OF CONTROL...............FIRST WARDO WITH THE KOALA BEAR IN AUSTRALIA AND NOW PAOLO WITH HIS DOG(MANS BEST FIREND?)
uh oh...
"If thou is found to be laying with the beasts of the field, he surely shall be put to death"
Tis,tis whats your fire dog going to think aren't you worried that she will get jealous. Does this mean that we wont be seeing the 2 of you together, French kissing and all, so sad. :
Rohnnie, The whole nutswinging thing actually turns her and the two legged wife on....so, it's a win-win for me!
"Have a great day my friend even though you are just a little strange. I think the reason I like you is that I finally found someone a bit stranger than I am."
Rohn, this part is a little bit disturbing to me to think I could actually be stranger than you!
"I just don't do those things that you do with the dog, now that is off the scales strange.
